Flashbank stronk. Rant even stronker.

TMG_v10_004-005Last of the short, first three chapters. The others are much longer, so I guess they'll take me more time.

Let's start off with a link before going onto the rant. Here.

A huge rant below, you have been warned.

 

Now, as for the rant... I'll just comment my thoughts on the sprouting happening that is people "asking" for donations for their translations. I won't comment on the quality of some of these people, which is tragic... because that's a topic for another rant, someday.

I do think that these people don't deserve a single cent. A single yen. That's a blatant attempt at using someone else's hard work, someone's else's story for your own profit. Even more so that some people go as far as to do a disservice to the original story by doing it in shit quality.

When I started my fan contributions as a manga editor, the environment was slightly different. There wasn't as much money-mongering among the manga communities aside from certain TAZMO incident and such. Since the beginning manga translations (there were no LN translations back then, or were almost non-existent) were by FANS and for FANS. No more no less. They weren't done for money, nor used to earn money (yes, I mean you, mangafox). Actual fans of a story did do their best to share the story with other fans who were unable to read it due to language barrier.

Even now I still abide by: from a fan, for the fans. That's why I promote purchasing original books instead of trying to make money off  things, that's why I promote the system of supporting singular books I personally AM fan of, for the people who are or might become its fans. I strongly oppose the recent trend of treating books and stories as fast food - the more the better approach that's been rampant lately.

In real world, if you had 75$ a month to indulge in your book-reading hobby, you would go to a bookstore and purchase the books that you like, their continuations or similar books then put them on the shelf and pride yourselves in having them in the collection. On the net, people started to treat books as something to read and forget. That is disrespectful to the book, the author and everyone else who worked on it.

It's gotten to a point where one guy came here a while ago and commented with something like this (quoting from memory, it's been long deleted from the archives, it was about OSO): "I think this book is shit I hate the main character for being bad, but I read it because there's nothing else".

That's how far it's gone. I do think a serious turnaround in the mentality among the LN community is needed. People have become drunk with sudden increase light novels and web novels availability, they forgot everything else other than absorbing more and more.

I'm going to continue working on my series and promoting the LNs I like, encouraging people to buy the original. I never got a single cent from working on either manga or light novels, neither from ads or donations. Nothing. I spend my own money and I'll continue to spend my own money on the domain, books I translate and other required things.

Well, it seems like I deviated from the topic, while it was about making money off translations at first, it turned into one about the state of LN community and mentality of the people reading it... I'm ashamed.

I'd like to thank all the guys who are honest fans of the light novels and thank twice the people supporting authors and the publishers.

It's been a while since I made a huge rant, it always ends up like this... I try to make a small comment and it turns into a humongous rant. Sigh.

Well then, since I already wrote it, I won't cut anything out. If you liked it and want me to comment on other things on how LN's translations state currently is, I might consider it.

You're free to disagree, you're free to hate as haters gonna hate. That is my own personal opinion.

——Krytyk

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65 thoughts on “Flashbank stronk. Rant even stronker.

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  1. Mizzu321

    i think what you said is right krytyk, when i'm children i always love anime and watch it on tv channel but for some reason most of anime not aired again in tv (i refrain to tell where i come) and that's come internet, i watch from there, then i across light novel the moment i read one of those i though wow this kind of novel so interesting, i want to buy the books but in my country there isn't a light novel sold who already in english, even if i find a light novel it still in japanese and that so rare that i can only find one even though it was a big bookstore, and in my country it hard for poor people to learn language, even i go this far in english because self study, but even right now i still struggle to learn japanese so that i can read my own without depend on the translator, that why the reason people like you translate so that we become fans and come to love this novel right?

    that's why thank for you work, even though there are some people like that at least not all of them

    Reply
  2. Vinh

    Krytyk how do you feel about donations in regards to fanfiction? Like of those on Royalroad or fanfictions based on other stories that ask for donations? Sorry it may be irelevant or perhaps you don't read fanfictions but, I'm interested in your viewpoint due to your viewpoint on fan translators asking for donations.

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      I think donation in fanfiction is all right, it's the author's own work so it's perfectly - ethically fine.

      Reply
      1. Sonoda YukiSonoda Yuki

        I wouldn't say perfectly. What I would say is that it depends on the author(s) of the derived work or works and their take on, well derivative works, and commercial activity thereof.

        Reply
  3. Fio

    Hi all!

    Thanks for translations krytyk and if you would be willing to take donations I would most likely would be throwing in a dollar for gesture.

    This is quite old topic, basicly 3rd party receiving payment when they change/add/deliver content which is based on another partys work.

    Yes, I believe it is okay to people get paid by work they do (this include youtubers, mod makers and random tranlators like krytyk ;D)[sorry, I just had to].

    People vote with their wallet and value of money is relative of person (For me 5 dollar is equal for meal or pack of cigarets, for someone else it is nothing).

    I note few things about myself here at end

    I am person with limited income, with love of books and chocolate, which both are expensive luxury goods.
    I purchase translated products (example SAO which I would have never started buying without fan translations).
    I would never pruchase product I cant read without extremly good reason.
    I already own hundreds of books (and I mean books, I also have hefty amount of Manga,LN and other lighter printed products) so I am very careful how to spend my money in those, great works which i have already enjoyed easily get spot in my collection.
    And I support nuclear power.

    (I went crazy for moment and ranted for while, until I realised it and censored most of it out)

    Basicly I wanted make constructive criticism and make people think about their stand regarldess of the side. I dont think it went well. But thanks for all who bothered to read until end.

    And thanks again krytyk your hard work, and becouse of you I shall purchase OSOs if they ever become readable (term was chosen purely of its multiple meanings).

    Your truly
    Fio

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      Of course everyone is entitled to their own opinion, what I wrote was my own opinion based on my own sense of ethics.

      Reply
  4. AoriiAorii

    If people are 'drunk' over here, what about in Japan?

    While I agree with most points you noted, I have my doubts on it ever turning around. The LN market has become a micro-culture that runs increasingly on populism and self-indulgence, prone to make poor judgment in order to bask in short term pleasure. It'd be like preaching self-control to hedonists...

    Heck, half the works coming out of the LN industry these days makes Twilight look like a nobel-winning literary masterpiece.

    As for the donations thing... well, the West wanted Capitalism. You've got Capitalism. Society has reaped its blessings, and now must suffer its consequences as everything slowly evolves to being ran by money, for money.

    Reply
  5. Zenithzwei

    *Jiiii~* I sensed a debatable thread here. And this... well, concerning the current state of foreign literature works. Just the cup of tea for me. Pleased to meet you everyone. And I won't hold back as I also find similar view with Krytyk-san. Also my own rants.

    Well, first thing first, the Translation. For the love of.... really. If you liked to translate stuffs, why begging for money? Isn't doing what you like better than sucking money? And I know that people have no choice but to work and be paid for the efforts they have done. But if you started it first by translating and then sharing the love.... why asking for payment? Did you do it for fun, or so that everyone that has the same love as you be happy, or is it so that you want to get praises and then given money? I can read hiraganas and katakanas but I am utterly hopeless in kanjis. So I know how hard translation is but still....... I would rather die out of translating for free than digging the fans' pockets when I have never even hold the real novel in my hands. I have a pride as a reader (and an aspiring author) and what is the purpose of being one? To support the author that wrote the book you read right? As an author, I am more than happy to see someone who smiles while buying and reading my books. Though I get the draft slammed to my face the moment Anego found out a character was modeled after her.

    Then the Donation. Heck, I don't really understand this 'money-milking way by using translation.' I recently started to be recognized as Adult by the country (age-wise), so my mind is still befuddled over my future career. And looks like society (or rather, my family) doesn't view my ability to write stories with values. Money, money and money, they said. Stable incomes, prospects when I have children, etc. Oh god, I have never even fallen in love in my entire life!! With that, I believe that putting efficiency before hobby won't cost you long-term happiness. I enjoy my life fairly enough even with the troubles and pesky dramas in the middle. Having extra pocket money is also within my ideas, but would I sacrifice the enjoyment and the love I have for the fantastic novels born from the sweats and tears of the authors to the point of being hospitalized? To be honest, I'm pretty serious to become an Author so I deny all paid translation of my works until a licensing agent knocked at my door. I would even hack the internet filters so that i can gain access to the online bookstores and buy the copies (not E-book, okay?).

    In all, Donations aren't needed (if you have internet then you can surely buy chips for breakfast right? Rather, just get a part-time work or full job already). Translation is a mean to share the love you have for a work without hurting the author. And it's DEFIINITELY not a tool so that you can grab money under pretext of translating. I dislike half-assed translation like that. It's already blasphemy for me. Though I'm still a fool in online business so I want to learn how to buy something online and I just obtained my own smart phone several days ago. 9 years with a phone looking like radio receiver was pretty bad. And I pay for what I like. Directly. Not to translators but to the authors, okay?

    Also, Krytyk-san, as this is my first post--thank you for the hard work and suppress the hatred in your mind. Emotions may affect your performance as well as health (out of experience). But seriously, can you help me buy actual copies? My country has severe laws when it came to licensing foreign works (especially from Japan). All I have in my shelf currently is only Penguin Summer, The-(forgot halfway)-'s Map and.... uh, I forgot the title but anyway, just three LNs which basically doesn't bend to fanservice or (extremely) appealing artworks + hundreds of mangas. The last LN is a bit... hm. Nearing shoujo ai but looks like the laws find no fault in it lol. So yeah, licensing AMA and OSO in my country would probably never happen including to most that I like to read. Teach me how to buy things online, Krytyk-san! I'm an utter technology noob! Please!! *orz*

    P.S: Oddly, sales of licensed products in my country inclined freedom to horror, evil stuffs, thrills and bloody violence more than to ecchiness despite it producing more brutal street slashers and corrupted youths in the road. I really can't understand humans. *shrugs*

    Reply
    1. sherrynity

      It's 'Leena'
      Leena's World Map, Penguin Summer, Candid, and I-forgot-the-name-lol

      The nearest place to buy it offline is Kinokuniya Singapore *cringe*. I want to buy it from Kinokuniya SG via online, but the last time I checked, they won't send the package outside of SG. If you buy it from outside of Indonesia, adding the fee to send them here, it could become twice of the price.

      ....... *silently crying*

      Reply
      1. charasuu

        the last one is that just released is "She Love you"

        in here, the place that can buy a english translated LN offline is kinnokunya JKT, but, the price is.....
        and if you want to import it...*double sigh*

        ....*crying in dark corner of room*

        Reply
  6. FollowerB

    "In real world, if you had 75$ a month to indulge in your book-reading hobby, you would go to a bookstore and purchase the books that you like, their continuations or similar books then put them on the shelf and pride yourselves in having them in the collection."
    I've found a comrade. Then comes the feeling of completion as you have the entire set on your shelve. Great feeling

    Reply
  7. A.A.

    Why would I buy a book I can't read?
    You need to understand, not everyone can afford to spend precious time, time needed for work, college, or otherwise, doing translations. Translations don't come from thin air. People put the work in.
    And eventually, once they realize it's more work than warranted, they'll dry up and disappear.
    Which is why fan translations exist. I'm all for supporting the original work, but I return to my original question.
    Why would I buy something I can't fucking read or understand?

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      If you read the books on my blog, it means you can understand them. You read the content written by the author, have you not?

      Reply
    2. danny

      He means buy the book if/when its available in your country/language, fool.
      Read the rant properly -_-

      Reply
      1. maxwell3094

        Really? Tbh it always sounds to me as though krytyk is pushing for people to buy the ACTUAL original copy. As in the JP copy. Im all for actually buying the books to support the authors but personally ill only buy if its actually picked up by a company here. For one buying a JP copy can be a pain. More importantly though buying a copy of a series from an actual publisher like Yen Press will help encourage them to license more series.

        Reply
        1. krytykkrytyk Post author

          Well, you guys are reading the actual book, nothing cut out, from start to end. It's not as much "supporting" the author, but paying him what you owe, you know? People actually have to PAY in Japan to read it, they go to a damn store and purchase it because it's a merchandise. This isn't some kind of voluntary action of supporting the poor starving authors. But since I can't "force you" to pay for it, I continue encouraging you to do it. If it was available in English, I wouldn't have translated it in the first place, and I will drop it the moment it's licensed.

          Reply
  8. Danny

    Hi Krytykal

    I just wanted to say, I agree with what you are saying and think that what you do is amazing.
    I have a severe sight issue that makes it extremely difficult for me to read small print on paper, as such reading online is the only thing i can do to satisfy my need for a good novel.
    I can't really support the author by buying to books for the above mentioned reason, however I properly intend to buy the anime disc once it's on sale!

    Thanks again for your hard work

    P.S. Due to my sight reading black text on a white background causes me a lot of discomfort, as such your website with its inverted contrast is the best! XD

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      Purchasing an ebook reader like kindle might be good for you, you can set up the size of the font to a sufficiently big one to read comfortably despite the sight issue, moreover they use a very natural paper-colourish tonation that's easy on the eyes.

      Reply
      1. Danny

        Is an English version of this already available? Didn't know it was out as an eBook
        if you can send me a link I'll get on it

        Reply
        1. krytykkrytyk Post author

          I'm not sure I understand what you mean. None of my series is licensed in English so it isn't available as such.

          Reply
          1. danny

            Ah, seems we confused each other :P
            From what you suggested, I thought you meant an ebook was already available to purchase.
            I get what you mean though, so if an English ebook should become available i will most certainly buy it :)

  9. Leonzell

    on the topic of buying light novels, as i have a limited budget and there is no retailers for official translated light novels (that i know of ) in Australia, i'm thinking of just still reading the fan translation without getting the japanese version (until i get a more stable and larger income) and import some official translation of things that i can't find online like spice and wolf (as i write this i just ordered volume 1 to test the site i bought it from) when i get more money i'll buy some japanese versions of the current fan translations and (hopefully) use it to try and learn some japanese to be able to read and maybe in a few years be able to translate myself.

    Reply
    1. Sonoda YukiSonoda Yuki

      https://australia.kinokuniya.com/

      if you live near Sydney, and online shopping just isn't your thing, you can even go here:

      The Galeries, Level 2,
      500 George Street
      (opposite QVB)
      Sydney NSW 2000

      Tel : +61.2.9262.7996
      (Opening hours: Mon to Wed and Fri to Sat - 10am to 7pm & Thu - 10am - 9pm & Sun - 11am - 6pm)

      Reply
      1. Leonzell

        thanks for the tip, i'm not too far from the gallery, according to google maps about 45 minute drive or i can take a train there, i might check it out when i have time.

        Reply
  10. JustChilling

    Hmmm... I not an avid reader but this problem extends to most media on the web so I think I can comment on this. Whenever I think of as to why good books, manga, anime tend to stay hidden behind much lower quality mainstream works I remember that at times it may be just my biased opinion. But then again, it takes time to appreciate most good works. And it takes a combination of wisdom, awareness of the environment of the book and the real world, knowledge of how both worlds function, and a good sense or maybe intuition for spotting relationships that are often not made evident on purpose to even understand those works. All are things which I think that in today's world are not pointing towards. That takes too much time and effort to do for some especially while being distracted due to the nature of the web. While some say the world is getting larger, I think the opposite is also true. Unlike before, it is now possible to live in this world with you as the centre of it, disregarding the significance of other people. That's the danger of the net, where now because of ease of access, the importance and value of the information at hand has been reduced. It funny that you could even compare it to a fridge where one gets mad because someone had forgotten to buy milk. A lot of people which I dare say most ,no longer think about the farmer or the distributor when they drink it or even give thanks to have been able to do. It the same for most games,novels,animation etc out there. It that the face behind the work no longer matters. My rant a bit (too) long so to end it i just say that this will get worse but I hope that did doesn't.

    Reply
  11. silver-hip

    - - to krytyk - -

    would just like to say a big thank you for all your hard work translating these wounder full light novels. thank you very much as a budding author its nice to see fan translations and their hosts/fans supporting the author.

    if posible ( if it ever happens that yen press/others) do decide to publish oso/ama will you post a link to were i and others can perches them, to encourage everyone to buy the books??? (i cant talk about others but my web skills suck)

    again big thank you

    silver-hip

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      Yes of course, I'm also considering adding links to purchasing original Japanese novels somewhere.

      Reply
  12. Virtual Livestock

    i do read lots of stuff and believe the more the better and i even forget about some but i only do this because i love to read and read for at least 3-4 hours a day as i love light novels, but i dont believe that people should just try make money off of their translations which is why if i ever find the books i always buy them (just last weekend i spent $203 AUD on novels) anyway, my point is that while i break a few of the things mentioned its only because i love to read and read a lot and i would like to say that anyone who reads anything and doesnt like it but keeps goin is a fool, and anyone who just reads them for the sake of it and not for the story and the tantalising plet, etc. can get bent... anyway, thats my opinion on the rant, also, keep up the translating, not only do u translate great stuff, i also can go on this website at school :D

    Reply
  13. umbro

    I agree. To make profit of someone's else work simply isn't right. And thanks for the new chapter Krytyk.

    Reply
  14. luis

    tienes razon, poner links como adf.ly para ganar dinero por medio de una traducción no oficial, daña a los autores, ya q ellos son los q en si se esfuerzan en la produccion de una novela, como un fan de habla hispana saludo tu opinion

    Reply
  15. Anonymous

    I agree with most of what you said, but there are some translators who ask to the authors if they can translate, what kind of legalizes their work. That's why I think that some people aren't doing anything wrong with accepting donations. But translator, who accept money or not, should all do like you and encourage people to support the author and buy the original. Above all, thank you so much Krytyk-sama! You're the best!

    Reply
  16. Fayte

    That hurts me. I have books, and love looking at them, remembering the great laughs they'd give me... it seems like We have gotten too old for the people of today...

    Reply
  17. Armando

    I agree with you. One little exception is the purchasing of the raws. Other than that, anything else is a disservice to the author who did all the hard work. And as far as the state of translated novels these days, you are absolutely correct that it became sort of a "fast food" mentality. It takes some time to find a really good translated novel to read and more often than not, you go through them and end up dropping them. I try as best as I could to buy translated novels that I like when they are available. I had always preferred real books anyway because I will always have them when I want to re-read them.

    Anyway, I just want to thank you for the work that you do for us, fans and nonfans alike. It is an almost thankless job that only those with great fortitude are able to do.

    Reply
  18. victorrama

    Agreed here. When I worked in scanlations, we did not ask for any donations or anything. We're doing things for free, from fans to fans. We even spent our money to buy the REAL book to support the author. Nowadays E-book or the likes are rather popular it seems. Instead of donating to a fan TL it would be better if you buy the raw books. Unless said TLer is like what Kry sama said, underage and/or unable to buy them. But those are very rare cases.

    Reply
  19. Nickholaevich

    well, i do partly agree on your thinking, but i do understand the hours and hours of work translators put in to translate annoying stupid kanji. however, i do think they deserve some money for the time they spent on this. to be honest with you, i hate those pay-for-chapter bull, but some are translating web novels that serve the purpose of providing escapist entertainment to the 10 million working class japanese people, those authors want their books promoted overseas, if they have enough support, they get mangas, animes, movies, licenses and cash start to go to them.

    PS: i still think that u are da best just because that awesome .org in ur website XD
    also, you cant buy webnovels T_T, I WANT THE ENTIRE COLLECTION OF MUSHOKU TENSEI AND DEATH MARCH T_T

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      Mushoku tensei has a light novel you can buy, money goes to the same author.

      I don't think translators deserve anything for a simple reason, it isn't legal, fan translations can be a grey area, but making money off the translations is blatant stealing - which is black. There's no "deserve". Either someone wants to translate and share stuff, or he doesn't. If the translator is making it dependent on donations - it turns into a job, money-mongering.

      I started to translate stuff to improve my language skills for both Japanese and English and to make stuff I like available, that is all. What I gained from all the translations is my improved skills, I share stuff while learning and improving myself.

      Fan translators have made light novels more popular in the west, thanks to which publishers like yen press have started to gain interest in them and release some.

      Reply
          1. krytykkrytyk Post author

            As far as I'm aware the syosetsu-based webnovel authors don't really get anything.

  20. Oblos

    I read them to read them. I try to buy the books when I'm not broke, but I don't make a huge effort. I also tend to turn into psycho-weeaboo a lot. I appreciate all your work, Krytyk. You aren't hypocritcal on your site, and you don't have excuses. If you take a break, you say so. If you cover a series/volume, you say so. And you actually do them. I want to be the one of the first of many: THANK YOU VERY MUCH FOR ALL OF YOUR WORK AND DEDICATION KRYTYK!!!!!! :)

    Reply
  21. Netto

    I do agree with your position that the translation donation scene has gotten warped in its sense of being used as a wage. If and when I do donate I would rather have the donation used to obtain the raws for the translation itself.

    On the other hand I do respectfully disagree with your position on how it is a "bad" mentality to have mass translation for the general reading public. While I do agree that the works need to be respected (I.e. discussions on such popular LNs like SAO) promoting the idea that the more the better is not good for the community just doesn't sit well with me. It creates a sense of exclusivity where only stories that are deemed worthy for reading by an arbitrary and subjective criteria are promoted.

    Anyway, I truly do appreciate your translations. While we might disagree on certain things, you are doing great work for the fans. ^_^

    Reply
  22. DJ

    In some ways you are certainly correct. But there are also points for 'motivating' a translator via donations. I love reading certain stories. LitRPG seems to be a genre that hasn't generated many ebooks you can buy on amazon. There are some that get translated to english by fans, OSO for one. But that is mostly only the case for japanese light novel sized novels. There are lots of those in chinese or even korean. I know about plenty of commercialized light novels, mangas and anime that were translated from japanese to english. I haven't seen that for chinese works. So, lets look at the best case study for donated translating in my opinion, wuxiaworlds coiling dragon series. The author has no plans to ever get his work translated into any other language and publish it in english, japanese, whatnot. The translator has written to the author about his translation and he (the author) does not care. Coiling dragon is a story that goes over 21 volumes and 600 chapters. And the author has several other stories in similar length to his name. Wuxiaworld now has from the beginning told that 1 or 2 chapters per week are planned. Each chapter takes 3 to 4 hours. No donations. Now, he offers his readers to donate money to speed that up. With 2 chapters per week that would mean i get to read the end of the story in 6 years. Great! Luckily the translator has invested plenty of time in the website as well as his work, the translation certainly seems to me to be one of the best compared to others.

    Of course, in his case i will never be able to buy anything commercial i can ever understand without learning chinese first. So, there is nothing i could spend money on to support that author. I guess with a population of 1.4b, around 20% of the worlds total population, the 330 million english language speakers don't seem like all that much.

    Reply
    1. krytykkrytyk Post author

      While certainly the translator might have wrote to the author about translations, but did he mention that he's making money of it? Calling a blatant way of making money "motivating" is an amazing attempt at being persuasive, but it clearly isn't "motivation". I suspect the DDoS wuxiaworld has suffered had something to do with that, most likely Chinese have gotten pissed off seeing him do that. (Yes I read 4chan, I read reddit, I read everything and I have a good memory).

      I'm against bringing money into fan translations, in any form. Well, I guess I could understand buying an underage translator a book he can translate if he cannot afford it, that's about it.

      Edit: This is dangerous trend, if it continues more and more people will continue to demand money to translate, turning it into a job. The next step, will be locking translations behind a paywall... it doesn't take much for "donations" and your so-called "motivation" to turn into locking stuff behind paywalls.

      Reply
      1. Coma

        Personaly... I'm all in for donation to the translators... AFTER I've given my contribution to the author by paing for the original book... well that is when I have the money to spare ^^' and since I'm (and have always been) an avid reader that FOLLOW 8 or more series (and not jumping in and out I seriously read all of them and every book at least 2 or 3 times... for some I even go back to them to reread a passage or chapter that have stroke to me even a few months later...) having all that money to spare for founding the translators is not always possible ^^ (after having bough 5 to 8 book in a single month ^^')

        The reason donation aren't a bad thing... is that I can understand how not everybody have the money to buy original material and keep up a blog to host them (I went trough such a period just time ago where I had problem paing for my intenet connection.. let alone any other more expensive hobby ^^')... but that is what those donation should be about... to help the translator share his work, as krytyk said "from the fan for the fan", and as a fan that haven't the compentence to tranaslate, I find right to help those that have that competence and the will to share... but seriously... just like krytyk I've seen plenty of translator ASKING for donation just for making money out of it... the best (or better to say worst) are some translator that makes the decision about what to translate based on the donation they recevid after posting a teaser of a new series (or cancel one just because they didn't recive enough donation after a month of translation on a specific new project...)... just like a tv station that decide if invest or not on a new series based on the marketing review... because the aim is the saim for both... get money... and this is sad... especialy when (as krytyk said) the quality is not even all that great... and sometime even I (that have only started to study the language a few months ago..) can really see how bad those translation are... :/

        well... we are lucky... we got kry here that not only is a good translator but als a conscientious man and a real fan... TY kry and don't worry about the lengt of your rants... as you can see you got good company when it comes to thinking about making things short and ending up making them lengty :P

        Reply
        1. Bunta

          "some translator that makes the decision about what to translate based on the donation they recevid after posting a teaser of a new series."

          Indeed. I saw that one... blatant saying he didn't got much donation so it would be dropping it... that is sad.

          Reply
      2. Caleb8980

        That edit is somewhat ironic, looking as starting today modders for Skyrim are able to charge money for their mods in the Steam Workshop - for which I have the same fear as you for translations - that someday there will be paywalls for all mods, because who likes to work for free if everybody else can get money for the same things?

        As with the oversaturation of reading books; I actually have to agree, many books nowadays are seen as fast food - things to read while sitting in a train waiting for your station to come up or sth like that, but you should also not forget that the authors themselves are making the books more and more shallow and easier to understand.
        The natural thinking process where you have to actually lay the book to the side to reflect about what you just read becomes shorter and shorter.
        Bestseller books todays (and nope I'm some old nostalgic geezer xD) rather often are a clusterfuck of overplayed cliches but still sell in the hundredthousands.

        Imo the fault lies within both sides, the readers as well as the authors.

        Reply
        1. AoriiAorii

          Search up nobel literature works, realize that they're typically not popular. Society, I'm disappointed in you.

          Reply
      3. DJ

        The first answer in Wuxiaworlds Q&A section tells us that the author was told twice about the translation of coiling dragon with a link so he could see it for himself. If he told wuxiaworld to stop doing that, the website wouldn't exist today. The translator lives in the US, which has strict copyright laws which even get followed up on. China seems to be the opposite. About 90% of the movie dvds to buy there are copies. At a quick look i have only found a few mentions where google, apple or some other huge company got sentenced to pay a few thousand dollars for offering books in their shops. Chinas copyright laws mostly come from trade agreements in which other countries have forced them on china. The understanding of 'legal' or 'fair' is a different one than for people from the US or EU.

        On a side note, the content mafia has been busy to make us believe that to copy is to steal something and therefore bad for the author, the market, the whole business sector. I doubt that very much. I'd be interested in how much money an author ends up with for works that get translated and sold in some other language.

        I remember reading about the history shortly after the printing press developed into a mass market for books and before someone came up with copyright laws and patents. The number of new books rapidly declined as soon as that happened. I can understand an author that wants to protect his works. I can't understand why it should be necessary to extend those laws to decades after the death of that author. And every few years the content mafia manages to push that further and further back. Can't have the beatles on the public domain, can't we? How would they be able to still make money from that otherwise.

        Reply
        1. AoriiAorii

          Copyright is a western thing in general. Neither the Middle East nor the Far East had a thing for it before the arrival of capitalism. Culturally, both groups lean more towards the "if you have an idea you should share it for the benefit of society" -- social-centric culture rather than individual-centric culture.

          And actually, no the "content mafia" isn't wrong. Rich authors are rare, same goes to extremely profitable game studios. Most authors out there don't earn that much, and the profit margins on most video games are very narrow. So yes, piracy hurts those common 'laymen' in the market by a lot. Besides, in a modern capitalistic world, everything ultimately comes down to money. The incentive to write, the motivation for a publisher to distribute, the demand by stores to stock -- all based on sales figures. Therefore when you pirate, you're not just hurting the author's motivation but also decreases his chances of getting his next story distributed.

          The thing to remember is that unless you're a famous author, publishing deals give only a very small cut of the selling price. So author income is all about mass quantity (and oversea quantity is always low due to simple numbers, but every bit helps). I suggest reading up on actual industry figures and learn the economics of distribution chains before forging your conclusion on the effects of piracy =P

          The main reason most translation work is considered acceptable is because it's work not locally published (yet!) and therefore the author wouldn't earn any money otherwise. Meanwhile, a translation project can spread popularity and increase the possibility a local publisher might make a deal to localize the book, thus benefiting the author. This dynamic changes again once the book is actually localized though.

          (this does not apply to movie studios by the way, who make too much money as is XD. Same goes to big music labels; indie artists need every bit of support though).

          Reply
  23. Mad anon

    Yeah.... Another guy(everybody knows who) was asking for 80-100 dollars to translate 1 chap..... That was just nuts. I just wonder if th ey even buy the book version later.... Probably not :-( some don't even link to the novels author page. Every time I read a chap I visit the author site with adblock disabled to give a page view to their ads at least.

    Reply
    1. DJ

      Oh, you mean the guy that couldn't stop spamming new posts, sometimes removing them after a time and such? I think he just got carried away and didn't really think much about what he was doing / asking. If his translation work isn't all that good and his blog gets more posts about polls and some new random ideas than translations, he wouldn't get all that many donations anyway. I wonder if he talks as much in real life. ;-)

      Reply
      1. Scarecrow

        Oh, that guy huh? Everytime a notification was sent, I only skim the post to see if it's a translation. The rest of the words I immediately dismiss it to /dev/null. Don't get me wrong, I usually read translators rants since it might concern the future TL works(orz).

        As for asking "donations". I honestly don't care, but I can't believe people would actually "donate" for that quality. Not to mention that guy isn't exactly asking a small amount per chapter. Just add another 50$ and you'll get a CS bible. 4 books, hard cover, and boxed from Amazon. Yeah, that's just for one chapter.

        I like reading from Krytykal site, since it's really easy to navigate and comfortable to read in mobiles. But I always felt bad everytime I see the domain. Even if you put a google adsense in the homepage, I don't think anyone would condemned you for it.

        Reply
    2. sauerkraut

      As if that $80/chapter wasn't bad enough, there's another guy offering $200/chapter. Money makes the world round I guess

      Reply
      1. OneSec

        Thats insane some people work for that mush for a month (I was one of them), I dont think the translation alone should be worth that mush (or even 80$).
        As for donation I dont mind it as long as it influence the TL positively and not the other way around.

        Reply
        1. krytykkrytyk Post author

          It is worth that much, but not from some idiot who does MTL. You can earn much more by translating, but you need to know the language.

          Reply
          1. OneSec

            I see I didnt know its worth that mush (googled) but I guess thats the price professional or at least qualified translator.

  24. Kemm

    Very true.
    I usually try to screen stories by plot before starting to read them, and my tastes are rather broad, so there are not many stories that I dislike. If I do find one, what I do is just stop reading it (if I have bought it or someone has given it to me as a present, I at least give it the benefit of the doubt and finish that volume) and never make a comment about it (there should be people who like them, I don't have to insult them or what they like).
    The series I like that I read online, I usually download them and store them, very much like I keep my books in shelves. If one of them gets published in my country, as long as my wallet allows it, ends in my shelves. I see it as normal, since the least one can do to thank authors for their work is up their sales, since not only they receive a cut of the shares, the number of sales tend to create some kind of hierarchy and bestow respect on them.
    It's true that we leve on an age of transient here and now, when people want things to be fast, just that. They can be trash, they can be pernicious, they can be whatever, as long as it comes fast and goes away, all's good. A sad, sorry state, but we can only cope with it and try to make one little effort towards change.

    Thanks for your work.

    Reply
    1. StealthAria

      I'm very much like you, One main difference is I'll buy the original work as soon as I can find it and loathe official translations. Official translators are slow and will drop a series simply because the most recent release had a small dip in sales, but they'll still claim rights to the entire series years after they've dropped it. For that reason I love translators like Tap and Yorai that keep translating even licensed works until they receive a notice from the licensing group telling them to take it down.

      Reply
      1. Kemm

        That's not so much different from me. I only said "buy it", not "like it". Something I like to tell from time to time is how angry I am with the spanish version of the Suzumiya Haruhi novels, with a lot of serious typos, character confussions and cover and inner cover inconsistencies, not to mention their guts to add a line to the first novel giving a name to Kyon. I've still bought and read as many of them as my money let me, though.

        Reply